I love the answers i have gotten so far by the legit users on this site.
Started a tournament and will have a matchup everyday?
This tournament consist of 16 of the best teams to not win NBA championships. 80’s Lakers and Celtics teams that lost do not count.
I am only counting teams that never went on to win. I am seeded them by record and home court goes to best record. I have selected these teams based on my own screening process
Today’s matcup is the 09 CAVS vs the 62 Lakers. User Rosco O. asked me to clarify the rules that these two teams would play under since they are from totally seperate era’s. I will say that the games in Cleveland have today’s rules and the games in LA have the old rules. Cavs have homecourt.
Here is the Lineups
C – Z.Ilgauskas
F – A. Varejao
F – L. James (MVP)
G – D.West
G – M.Williams
C Rudy Larusso
F Jim Krebs
F Elgin Baylor (38ppg that year)
G Frank Selvy
G Jerry West (30ppg that year)
Please only answer who would win this matchup. Other matchups will follow. Please be as thorough as possible as to why you stand behind whatever team you choose. Tommorow I will continue to matchups. Person with the most logical and thorough answer gets best answer. We will decide together who the greatest team to never win a title is.
Remember majority rules here. It doesn’t matter what I think however my vote does count.
BQ – what not played yet matchup would you like to see next
Here is the seeding and current results.
1) 07 Dallas Mavs 67-15 DEFEATED 16) 88 Mavs 53-29 (already done)
2) 09 Cleveland Cavs 66-16 vs 15) 62 Lakers 54-26 (IN PROGRESS)
3) 97 Utah Jazz 64-18 DEAFEATED 14) 87 Atlanta Hawks 57-25 (Already done)
4) 96 Seattle Sonics 64-18 VS 13) 86 Milwaukee bucks 57-25 (not played yet)
5) 93 Phoenix Suns 62-20 DEF 12) 92 Blazers 57-25(already done)
6) 2005 Phoenix Suns 62-20 vs 11) 98 Pacers 58-24 (Not played yet)
10) 96 Orlando Magic 60-22 7) DEFEATED 02 Sacramento Kings 61-21 vs(already completed)
8) Miami Heat 61-21 vs 9) 93 New York Knicks 60-22 (not played yet)
EXTRA* If cavs try to run they will get destroyed teams back in the 60’s put up 130 like it was nothing.
Thanks for the rules notification.
Best of 5 1st Rd series. 2-2-1 format.
Result- 61/62 Lakers Vs 08/09 Cavs
1. Williams Vs. West: Miss Match West: Mo would be stunned game one by how athletic West is and even more amazed by his shooting ability. Aside from getting his own shot west would avg. 5 made 3’s a game shooting 44-48% from the 3 pt line.
2. D.West Vs. Selvy- Advantage West: Selvy at this time was a grizzled vet that got the job done solid defender and avg 14 pts pg. West eeks out the advantage by being picking up all the hustle points. Loose balls, rebounds &: other intangibles.
3. LBJ Vs. Baylor- Miss Match Baylor: Trouble for the Cavaliers as Elgin enjoys the new NBA rules during games 1&: 2. He proceeds to light the cavaliers up for 68 pts. in game 1 out scoring LBJ by 30. Mid way thru the 4th qtr. LBJ is heard yelling at Mike Brown for not devising a better defensive strategy. At this point fatigue sets in and Lakers pour on the coals.
4. Varejao Vs. LaRusso- Advantage LaRusso: Varejao provides his normal energy but becomes increasingly frustrated by the lack of impact opportunities due to the fundamentally strong LaRusso. It seems on every shot LaRusso finds a way to get his body on him. Offensively LaRusso continues to ride the gravy train and picks up an easy 20 pts. from all the attention given to Baylor &: West.
5.ILgauskis Vs. Krebs-Slight Advantage Z: The Lakers notorious small lineup will face some issues early in the 1st qtr. LBJ will listen to his coach for a few possessions &: dump the ball inside. Unfortunately for the cavs their lack of perimeter shooting &: Z’s lack of post moves gets them down early and LBJ takes over all offensive responsibilities.
Bench- Advantage Cavaliers: With their two stars avg. over 40 min. a game the Lakers find little reason to depend on their bench. The only player getting major minutes this series is their 7’0 center Ray Felix.
Coaching-Wash: Although Brown knows the game of basketball the present day player doesn’t allow him to run the team. Fred Schaus ends his short head coaching career with the Lakers.
Intangibles. Unfortunately for the Cavs the 62 Lakers can move up and play this brand of basketball and actually have it improve the ability of their two HOF’s. Conversly LBJ struggles in LA due to the emphasis on 1 dribble 1 step, palming violations and actual pivot foot rules. With no way to get to the rim he proceeds to jack up tough outside shots and shoots a horrible 28% from the field.
Intestinal Fortitude: These Lakers were Mentally tough they lost year after year but always bounced back. Cavaliers however still have self doubt and really don’t trust their own record.
Even more than the evolution of the game and athleticism, I also think you have to look at how the rules that we are using might actually help the road team. This is a great example – by using ’90 rules for Cavs home games, I believe that would help the Lakers given the scorers they have in West, Baylor and a lesser extent in Selvy. I would really like thier chances in road games because of the fundamentals needed to be good jump shooters, even if the shots are long.
Something else I find interesting in this matchup is how in the day of this Lakers team, big men were of extreme importance. After all, wasn’t this team denied by one of the greatest centers of all time, Bill Russell? Today, there is less reliance on the big man, and that helps out teams like the Cavs, who didn’t have great players at center (not dissing them, especially Z, who I like, but really they don’t make Wilt shiver in his sneakers!). Again, something that I do think would actually help the old-timers.
What would really dictate this series is the pace of the play. If the Cavs can use thier atleticism and run, run, run, they would run the Lakers out of the gym. However, there still has to be some downtime, and those fundamentals mentioned would work well for the Lakers. Since I don’t believe either team has a huge advantage in either offense, defense, rebounding or intangibles, this would be the key. Even thought I am an old-timer by this board’s standards and Jerry West is one of my all time favs, I gotta go with the Cavs in this one.
BQ – Knicks and Heat. Although I hope their scores are a little higher than the usual 72-70!
I find it funny that the 09 Cavs are even being considered. Anyone who picks the cavs is absolutely out of their mind.
The ’62 Lakers were a team with two hall of famers that took a team ,which many consider to be the best ever, to a game 7 overtime, and was a few inches from being champions. Compared to a team that got destroyed in 5 games by a team that was thoroughly out played in 5 games in the finals.
Damn. I have to give it to the Jazz. The Stockton/Malone duo just kills the West/Baylor duo.. and Jeff Hornacek was very underrated. Greg Ostertag was a great defensive player on the inside and can block shots like crazy. And I think Jeff Hornacek, Greg Ostertag, and Byron Russel, beat Frank Selvy, Rudy Larusso, and Jim Krebs easily. And neither of them really have a bench, but the Jazz bench beats the Lakers bench. So Jazz win 4-2.
Might be the first gigantic upset so far in this tournament. First I’ll review the Lakers.
Lakers review: Let’s start by saying the Lakers in the Conference Finals took one of the greatest teams in NBA history to the brink of elimination: losing in 7 games to the Celtics. Elgin Baylor was an absolute monster this year averaging 38ppg and 19rpg, while Jerry West was no slouch himself putting up 31ppg and 8apg. The other help comes from Rudy LaRasso with a nice 17ppg and 10rpg on the interior. Stopping Elgin Baylor would be absolutely key for LeBron James whose defense has improved but is not anywhere near the level of elite which would be necessary to contain Baylor this season. I’m a huge Delonte West fan but he’d struggle mightly with Jerry West, and Mo Williams would be a joke defending The Logo. LaRasso was a decent player as well for rebounding.
Cavs review: Built fairly well around LeBron James, they’re heavily concentrated on man-to-man defense both on the perimeter and at times on the inside. Man-to-manning Jerry West and Elgin Baylor with the talent they have would be incredibly difficult. They could take advantages of size differences on the inside with a bigger Big Z over LaRasso: but unfortunately Z’s inside game isn’t much of anything at this point, he’s more of that small jump shooter, so that’s not quite going to work.
Backcourt: Edge to Jerry West and Frank Selvy over Mo Williams and Delonte West — West would be an absolute nightmare for either of those players, and Selvy was a solid contributor. Not to mention, Mo Williams disappears in playoff games.
Forwards: Even — James must focus on getting to the lane and kicking the ball out. I think the 6’8 James getting into the lane to go over a 6’7 LaRasso could be an advantage, but I doubt Baylor lets him get there with ease.
Frontcourt: Edge to Anderson Varejao and Big Z over Jim Krebs and Rudy LaRasso — I won’t pretend to know much about Krebs and LaRasso other then statistics: but I do know that Big Z isn’t much of an interior player, and Varejao has little to no offensive game here. This edge is strictly for rebounding purposes. Not much of a factor in this series.
Lakers in 5. West and Baylor is too much for LeBron James and the team around him to handle. Yes, team chemistry is important, but strangely enough, I feel that the two players mentioned in West and Baylor would make short work of this team.
EDIT: Ya returning with this on Monday? Or tomorrow? Haha would enjoy another one today to kill time: since I won’t be on here on the weekends, but it’s cool if you want to keep it daily.
EDIT: Same boat as you then.
you also have to factor in the evolution of sports, i know a lot of old farts on here will get mad and give me a thumbs down for saying this but easily the 09 cavs it’s a different game now and a lot more fast pace and less fundamental…and there is only one fundamental based superstar left in the NBA and that is Tim Duncan, with that being said i’ll take 09 cavs and put a heavy purse on it…
no disrespect to the legends that paved the way
Wow, this is a hard one.
Well if you wan’t to do it like this, it might be easier.
Mo Williams vs. Jerry West – The obvious better player is Jerry West, even if he is a SG playing point. But the fact is, Mo Williams pretty much gave the Cavs 60 wins because him and LeBron and such a great pair… So if I were to pick Mo, it would be because he has a dynamic Duo that is very good, sure Jerry West has Elgin, but I think LeBron will easily surpass him…. BUT!
WINNER: JERRY WEST.
Delonte West vs. Frank Selvy – Well, Frank Selvy is a good 15 5 and 5 guy. But Delonte West is a very underrated player. He can pass, defend, rebound, shoot, and is a much better 1 on 1 type of guy is you ask me.
WINNER: DELONTE WEST
LeBron James vs. Elgin Baylor – Well Elgin Baylor isn’t a power guy, he is a finess guy, and LeBron would overpower him way way way to easy. Elgin Can shoot, dunk, lay it up, but isn’t a great defender imo, and LeBron is.
WINNER: LEBRON JAMES
Anderson Verajao vs. Jim Krebs – I am not even going to lie, all I know about Jim Krebs was that he can barely score but he is a great rebounder. So sorry :/
WINNER: ANDERSON VERAJAO
Illgauskas vs. Larusso – Rudy Larusso was a very good rebounder this season and a pretty decent scorer too. And as history shows, he has always been good at both of them… Illgauskas is a good shooter, and rebounder though, only he isn’t athletic at all. And he is very awkward. But he is very effective. Rudy Larusso shoots at a very low % so…
So I say the winner is the Cavaliers.